第三類接觸

[蔡自富]

今年最詭異的情節剛剛發生了，我實在無法歸類，姑枉稱之第三類接觸。

今年三月本站成立以後，我收到一位自稱是58航海學長的EMAIL。他說了一堆恭維的話，然後告訴我一個很好的投資機會 ── 使用燃料電池的電動車。
First, I'd like to thank you for setting up such special fun place for all of us from 海專。I wish i can contribute something here although I think what i have might be very small and limited. Reading your resume, you are such an outstanding individual that makes me proud of myself being graduated from the same school.

I came to US in 1982. Looking back these years, I have to say, its been quite a life experience. With my age inching higher every year, I started looking for something for my retirement two years ago. One day, I accidentally found a group of people working on a simple device called "Hydrogen Fuel Cell". This is not the kind of fuel cell we have been seeing on news. In fact, this is just a simple water electrolysis device we have become familiar since high school. Due to oil price was expected to go high, people started looking for fuel saving solutions.

This was in early 2007. For the past two years, I have spent a great deal of time and effort learning so much about different possibilities/theories of energy. It is absolutely fascinating. My research in this has broaden my vision on this world and universe.

Let's go back to the device I want to talk about here. We all have been convinced that the water electrolysis process takes more energy than the energy you can collect from the hydrogen and oxygen gases. So the process is meaningless in term of looking for energy sources. Well, from what i have read and seen, I am afraid I have a different thought here.

Since last Oct, I became a friend of this young man in Taiwan who put together a water fuel system in his car. The car works like a bi-fuel car. You can switch the fuel from gasoline to water, yes WATER, once the car gets up to about 20-30 km/H speed. The car would then run on water up to 80 Km/H. I myself have seen and driven this car last Oct when I visited Taiwan. I am in fact working to help him to set up his company even though there are many potential investors are talking to him trying to grab this amazing technology.

I am still working full time but plan to retire soon. So I am hoping to gather some prospects and potential working partners for a future water fuel generator. Imagine if this system in converted to a generator. Why I want to do generator and not car? Because generator will have much less hassle with the laws and regulations. I am confident I'll have a great chance of becoming a distributor of his products when his products are available.

Even more, I have been contributing what I know about this device when I have a chance. He certainly knows how much I know in this area.

Anyway, I'd like to spread this message out to everyone here on this blog but not quite publicly. So i am requesting you to forward my message to any person whom you think might have the eager for alternative energy. I'll be very happy to answer any question any time. And yes, I do have a few short videos for those who are interested.

後來和他SKYPE過一次，這個科技據他說是台灣某位僅有高中學歷的朋友發明，這車可以使用普通燃料，開到每小時20公里以上時產生的電力足夠以電解的方式分裂水成為氫與氧。然後系統使用產生的氫與氧來發電（副產品是水），自此切換成電動車模式。而車的運作持續產生電力，用來再裂解水成氫/氧，自此生生不息。

聽到這裡，也許會有校友覺得這真是個好主意，沒有污染、又不耗費燃料。可是很抱歉，這在物理學上是不可能的任務，理由相信許多人都知道，尤其是對機械、物理有一點概念的朋友。所以各位可以瞭解我對這位所謂的學長有多驚訝，為了怕本站校友受騙，我反覆詢問細節（他也不知道），還要求他給我這位發明家朋友的資料，我說我要和他聯絡。原來以為他會知難而退、這事就此結束，沒想到最後他還真寄來了。所以今年春天回到台灣以後，我特意查了海專校友名冊，發現58航海確實有這位學友。

從以上EMAIL的內容看來，他可能發給過許多人。雖然他在本站也有註冊，但是從未發言、惡跡不顯，我也因此沒有繼續追蹤。但是這兩天他又寄EMAIL來，問我是否有興趣和他朋友合搞汽車零件業網站
How have you been?

I met a guy who has been working on developing XXXXXX.com for a while. He says he has been in car biz for about 18 years. Usually, they pay for data search service. Currently, he pays $200+/mon for parts. So his idea is to have a website that would be only for everything about cars. Local, out of state and international...etc.

Anyway, he is just starting and he recruits me for Chinese/Asia part of the plan. I think it's a good ideal. Don't know if you are interested in? If you are, please let e know. I am more than happy to discuss this in details with you. Thks

我在1999年搞過達康，對這方面有點瞭解，而且我對汽車零件業最近也常接觸，因此我回他
There are plenty of car part sites already, and some have been there for years.
Do a search and see for yourselves. http://www.google.com/search?q=car+part ... =firefox-a

Even Amazon carries parts. I don't think the world needs another. http://www.jcwhitney.com/Auto-Parts/10101.jcw

自此，對話的品質開始下降，收到這樣的回信：
Thanks for your input. You just sound way too much pride for me. You haven't even learn what he has to offer. yet you seem to be able to make quick judgment as you did...

I think I talk to the wrong guy.

收到這種信我也有點不高興，所以翻了他之前燃料電池的老帳
You didn't mention anything about his edge or strategy so I assume it is pretty much negligible. And I learned that even if one has some edge, it is no competition to a sound bottom-line. So feel free to draw you own conclusion.

Btw, I checked you out and verified you are indeed who you said you were. Otherwise I wouldn't even bother to talk to you after your magical fuel-cell car proposal.

他的回信品質繼續下降
No need to explain. The "magical" water fuel system is still stand as a fact regardless what you think. I challenge you, Mr. Tsai, step up to prove it wrong/fake or any of your comment is not worth any attention. I am not asking you for any money.

If not for you are one of my school mate, I would not even come to talk to you. While you might think you are very good, there are always people better than you one way or the other. Trust me and mark my words!

既然他要證明，我就給他證明
It is proven centuries ago. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_motion
這是中文版 http://zh.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E6%B0%B8% ... 8%E6%9C%BA

老實說，基於對他的瞭解，我不期待他有能力和我辯論。但是收到以下這種國小程度的回信，我還是很驚訝。
You are such an arrogant idiot! If is was proven century ago why you had doubt to begin with? What is "magical" about? Show it to me how it is done?

You really think you are the best??? Give me a break!!!

From you first email... You thought I don't know much about computers. You were showing off your knowledge about computers. Let me tell you, I still do computer programming for my works.

自此我把他的EMAIL放進「必殺」的過濾器裡，不再浪費我的時間
You asked for proof and proof is given. If you can't stop acting like a 3rd grader, you are not worthy of my time.

海專出了不少聰明人，自然也有一些不那麼聰明。但是像這種程度的，還真是少見。老實說，我不相信他真的這麼笨，因為不可能有人這麼笨。

我把這經驗貼出來，希望校友們知道有這麼號人。實在不知道如何命題，也因此姑且名之。

[nicholas]

嘿嘿~好玩咧!
有這樣的集資方式喔!!

[張紹康]

第三類接觸著名的音樂：

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHP2Ysw8aqw

張小燕有沒有？

[徐揚榮]

我同學於十多年前由大陸返台的聚餐中談話中說"大陸什麼都是假的.只有騙子是真的"
華人社會中總是把國粹發揚光大"老鄉騙老鄉"."族群的利益爭奪"等.看了第三類接觸的永動機必須是對熱力學有相當研究的人.才有能力可提出.因為熱力學我在學校是低空pass.且鐵路特考恰好是有1題問答題才沒有0分.所以我是不會拿熱力學去和別人PK.
註A:聽說鐵路特考其中熱力學是由考試院出題.命題教授由台大(5題有1題問答)今年出及台北工專(5題全部計算題)明年出題.輪流順序.
註B:必須提一下低空pass的遊戲.很多人不懂(他們程度水平太高).加100除以2或開根號乘以10.

[nicholas]

技術我不懂!!
我只知道集資方式這樣是很不可思議的~
要可行性評估報告一堆....
亂槍打鳥好像很難中的
以這個project我的經驗是發表說明會很重要(前提是可行性報告已經都ok),就像藥品一定會經過動物實驗後再人體實驗...
撇開這些不談...如果真的技術可行全球大車廠就會自動找上門

[joe]

水電池是高等文明科技，目前僅知唯一的實際運用，是在飛碟上。

外星人，尿尿後回收，做為飛碟的動力來源。

這就是第三類接觸。

地球目前的科技是，傳統汽車電池內，若水位下降，加點蒸瘤水，自來水也可以應應急。單靠電瓶，電動車當然可以跑。但是充電還是要，發電機，動力源自汽油。

我還沒試過，外星人的辦法，因為電瓶的洞太小，我瞄不準。

[nicholas]

我在大陸是沒看到對方錢付出來我是不會諮詢顧問的
包括~每日零用金 機票 四星級旅館以上住宿 交通食宿費等!!
台商也是很摳~都以為請吃幾頓飯就要我的概念

[張紹康]

其實 是有用水動力的車啦！叫 Honda FCX
自去年？起 只租不賣 每月六百元 如果您家附近有加水站 才考慮租給你啦！
我曾想租一台 但想想就算了！過濕癮不成 只好過乾癮啦！

難到這門技術已由我們的高中學歷的學生 過繼給本田了嗎？
那這教改 還改的真有料嘞！以前罵過李遠哲的人們 都請好好的道歉 反省！


賞車：
http://automobiles.honda.com/fcx-clarity/

工作原理：
http://automobiles.honda.com/fcx-clarity/vflow.aspx

[joe]

謝謝SHELDON的貼文，又學到一些。

GOOGLE 了一些利用氫氣為動力的文章

http://www.eia.doe.gov/kids/energyfacts ... rogen.html

看起來好像是加氫氣，但不是加水，自富學長提的是加水就可以了。

熱力學理，能量守衡定律。分解水產生氫需要能量，fossil fuel, radio wave coal 等等.

The problem was never could you build a fuel cell that would consume hydrogen, produce electricity, and fit in a car. The problem was always, can you make hydrogen fuel at a price point that makes any sense to anybody. And the answer to that to date has been no 「4」

electrolysis 是另一種法子，利用化學反應直接分解水

但是Electrolysis, currently the most inefficient method of producing hydrogen, uses 65 to 112 percent of the higher heating value on a well-to-tank basis.[1]

截自
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_production

更詳細的氫氣生產介紹。

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_production

氫氣汽車的介紹。

The magazine also noted that most hydrogen is produced through steam reformation, which creates at least as much emission of carbon per mile as some of today's gasoline cars. On the other hand, if the hydrogen could be produced using renewable energy, "it would surely be easier simply to use this energy to charge the batteries of all-electric or plug-in hybrid vehicles「5」

On May 2009 the U.S. Secretary of Energy Stephen Chu announced that since fuel cell hydrogen vehicles "will not be practical over the next 10 to 20 years", the U.S. government will "cut off funds" for development of hydrogen vehicles, although the DoE will continue to fund research related to stationary fuel cells. The difficulties in the development of the required infrastructure to distribute hydrogen was also mentioned as a justification for cutting research funds「6」

reference:

[1} ^ Ulf Bossel,Energy and the Hydrogen Economy
[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_production
[3]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_production
「4」http://www.financialpost.com/story.html ... 29&k=80493
「5」 a b c Wrigglesworth, Phil. "The car of the perpetual future"' September 4, 2008, retrieved on September 15, 2008
「6」^ a b c Matthew L. Wald (2009-05-07), U.S. Drops Research Into Fuel Cells for Cars, The New York Times, retrieved on 2009-05-09

附註：wikipedia 的引用，在很多學術RESEARCH的領域是不被接受。但是從SHELDON的貼文，再看了這些文章，又學到一些新知，充實了自己，我想這才是最重要的部分。

引用學術文章是要付費的。

JESS 和自富學長是碩士，應該能提供更詳細的reference引用解說。

[Jesse]

既然研發出來了, 應該有東西可以看吧? 最起碼有研究數據吧? 專利呢?